tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post5637347592019618924..comments2024-03-05T12:41:20.217-05:00Comments on Low Sec Lifestyle: Rambling: Miswired Sugar Kylehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15437978687639772023noreply@blogger.comBlogger36125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-71102950932767269872015-03-29T18:06:49.434-04:002015-03-29T18:06:49.434-04:00Man, I guess the people telling me it once got so ...Man, I guess the people telling me it once got so bad their coalition-leader flipped out and dropped all sov because he couldn't take all those toxic pubbies anymore really weren't joking.<br /><br />Then there was that stuff I only half-remember about a great purge during something called the "cultural revolution". If my memories are correct, that was something awful indeed.<br /><br />But even though, the player base even in that neck of the woods isn't really friendly to women, I think. Hopefully the situation gets better in the future, it would be sad to lose another future Sugar Kyle just because so many players are assholes.Libluinihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15524606710871977666noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-91077738656756729112015-02-02T17:31:41.482-05:002015-02-02T17:31:41.482-05:00"Except that you're not really gone, you&..."Except that you're not really gone, you're still watching it from the sidelines,"<br /><br />I take it you never watch a sporting event if you don't currently play for a team in the league?<br /><br />There is much amusement to be had from merely watching EVE "from the sidelines".Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-11859507778640584242015-01-30T15:45:25.603-05:002015-01-30T15:45:25.603-05:00There is also a lot of hypermasculine vitriol in t...There is also a lot of hypermasculine vitriol in the threads about the removal of AWOXing.<br /><br />There is a lot of gloating about 'ganker tears' punctuated by the occasional homophobic or misogynistic remark. If the comment isn't being made by a null-sec player who thinks that anyone who does PVP outside of their corner of the sandbox is a beta 'faggot' then it is probably by that special kind of EVE player who often wishes (or even threatens) real-life harm on you and yours because you beat them in a game.<br /><br />Whether you just ganked a barge or got ganked in one, nobody should be spitting on their opponent.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-37702471959169885142015-01-30T14:25:05.005-05:002015-01-30T14:25:05.005-05:00The whole point is not whether the game is appeali...The whole point is not whether the game is appealing to women or men, it is more about the tolerance level one is willing to accept.<br />It may be that initially it appeals to both equally.<br />However, the perception that the game is accepting of the view that it caters to borderline or full blown sadists in it's ranks, makes us all question from time to time what we can tolerate.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-64207547068326967522015-01-29T19:55:10.250-05:002015-01-29T19:55:10.250-05:00"But we don't hear about them."
And..."But we don't hear about them."<br /><br />And you are surprised? Why would I advertise fleet services casually? May as well hang a sign on the back of the hull "gank me". Anonymity remains the best defence I possess.Easy Eskyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17882509080454825895noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-59196589950631651012015-01-29T15:53:05.078-05:002015-01-29T15:53:05.078-05:00Insult? Who did I insult? Being a misfit in EVE is...Insult? Who did I insult? Being a misfit in EVE is a honor, compared to fitting in as well as erotica1.Angry Onionshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02750018939886265706noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-90820806354446587452015-01-29T15:51:03.085-05:002015-01-29T15:51:03.085-05:00To: DireNecessity
Re: Female competiveness
What I...To: DireNecessity<br />Re: Female competiveness<br /><br />What I said is that women compete against other women. Most men fail to understand that there is such competition, though.<br /><br />In the event that EVE appealed to women for the reasons it appeals to men (feeling alpha), it would be something to behold. And very harsh.Angry Onionshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02750018939886265706noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-9347655960207703092015-01-29T12:58:25.827-05:002015-01-29T12:58:25.827-05:00Exactly that, yes.
The "must use voice comms...Exactly that, yes.<br /><br />The "must use voice comms" requirement isn't a hurdle for us, but it can be a deal-breaker for a woman who's been burned for daring to be obviously female on comms. You can even find well-meaning advice online about how it's just better for women to remain silent, which isn't retrograde at all, right?<br /><br />In EVE, a refusal to get on voice comms and speak shuts you out of just about everything that leads to player retention, so the different experiences men and women have online become urgently relevant. Obviously, it doesn't shut *everyone* out, but if it even shuts out most, or half, it's a significant loss to the game.<br /><br />Then there's the gay woman I know, who has to be even more wary...Dersen Lowerynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-84531769467014089352015-01-29T12:13:31.155-05:002015-01-29T12:13:31.155-05:00Men don't hesitate to join voice comms because...Men don't hesitate to join voice comms because we don't really have to worry about how we're perceived. In an odd way for men voice comms are a great equalizer as long as it's just the game being discussed it removes ethnicity, education, class, culture, religion, politics. Though we replace some of those instantly with in game variants who you are in the real world is mostly irrelevant. It's great escapism. <br /><br />It's also male privilege. <br /><br />Because if you're a woman an you come on comms you're going to asked what you look like, what you do in the real world what your interests are... And much of the anonymity it provides men doesn't get to exist for you as a woman. And while some women might enjoy the attention I bet a great many of them don't. (Obviously I'm writing this as the observations of a bloke so I might be way off).<br />Kaeda Maxwellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13954843678698092456noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-81950449855951434262015-01-29T12:07:58.107-05:002015-01-29T12:07:58.107-05:00Except that you're not really gone, you're...Except that you're not really gone, you're still watching it from the sidelines, looking for that opportunity to get back into it...<br /><br />Why bother with it at all and continue to insult people who are playing it?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-91323419545822516942015-01-29T11:01:05.129-05:002015-01-29T11:01:05.129-05:00I wanted to add that the attrition rate--male or f...I wanted to add that the attrition rate--male or female--is extremely high, but I'm wondering if it hits women disproportionately because men don't generally even hesitate to join voice comms (and sure, there are exceptions to that--gay men, for example, might have learned to do the same thing rather than listen to the f-word getting thrown around constantly and negatively).Dersen Lowerynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-56454832210194179552015-01-29T10:57:36.383-05:002015-01-29T10:57:36.383-05:00Journalists always approach stories with an angle,...Journalists always approach stories with an angle, so no real surprise there.<br /><br />Rykki's statements dovetail almost exactly with the observations I've heard from the women I've played EVE with: The game is great, the lore is great, the complexity is great, the sandbox is great, but the toxicity of some of the player base is not. It's not even a question of being bullied or hurt or offended so much as not wanting to spend their free time putting up with the same crap they want to get away from after a long day.<br /><br />The demographics don't just alarm women, either. I've spent more than a few evenings mulling the significance of the fact that I play an overwhelmingly white, male game, and I'm a white male.<br /><br />The problem's much, much bigger than EVE; I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that part of it involves the EVE NPE, though it's not necessarily something the NPE can fix. There are web sites full of examples of abuse hurled at women on, say, Xbox Live, and World of Warcraft. It's entirely possible that a woman considering EVE has already learned to avoid voice comms. If they find out that most corps require voice comms, then maybe they don't join a corp, or they join a failcorp that doesn't care because it doesn't really do anything coordinated anyway. The attrition rate among players like this--male or female--is extremely high.<br /><br />I'm not sure how to solve that problem. EVE Voice with really good filters could disguise whether a player is male or female (or a spy, so savvy corps might either not use it or require that there be no filter applied), but it won't fix the problem of alienating and dehumanizing language from other players. Only the players can do that. That's a much bigger issue than EVE as well.Dersen Lowerynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-31726152956606600502015-01-29T10:30:15.268-05:002015-01-29T10:30:15.268-05:00Re: Angry Onions January 29, 2015 at 6:30 AM
Quot...Re: Angry Onions January 29, 2015 at 6:30 AM<br /><br />Quote:<br />A funny part is that EVE would have more female players if those female players were fighting against female players. A "female only" server would reach such degrees of viciousness as to make "The Lord of the flies" look like a picnic at the Downs...<br /><br />Interlocutor:<br />Did Onions just state that sans the guiding influence of men, women gamers would descend into such viciousness the very universe would tremble?<br /><br />DireNecessity:<br />I see no other way to read it.<br /><br />Interlocutor:<br />Makes public how Onions as little but a bigoted, sexist hate filled Troll, yes?<br /><br />DireNecessity:<br />I see no other way to read it.<br />DireNecessitynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-56365086230525519972015-01-29T09:30:35.363-05:002015-01-29T09:30:35.363-05:00A funny part is that EVE would have more female pl...A funny part is that EVE would have more female players if those female players were fighting against female players. A "female only" server would reach such degrees of viciousness as to make "The Lord of the flies" look like a picnic at the Downs...Angry Onionshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02750018939886265706noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-18410403542739449892015-01-29T09:26:15.473-05:002015-01-29T09:26:15.473-05:00"And hyper masculinity is very toxic to '..."And hyper masculinity is very toxic to 'non-alpha' males as much as it to women"<br /><br />Totally agree with this. Just pick any random comments at the Hyperdunk thread; would you PAY for playing that game? For being like THEM? Even after 25?<br /><br />But then you can't expect better from CCP.Angry Onionshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02750018939886265706noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-21965518666330763302015-01-29T07:54:50.831-05:002015-01-29T07:54:50.831-05:00Good, honest post, Sugar - thank you. You do indee...Good, honest post, Sugar - thank you. You do indeed count, and all you are doing for our community makes a difference. Keep up the good work.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17750779710647245446noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-5123123068340161452015-01-29T02:54:50.500-05:002015-01-29T02:54:50.500-05:00"I hope that it gets rid of you first Onions...."I hope that it gets rid of you first Onions..."<br /><br />It already did. EVE gameplay summarizes as "fuck or be fucked". Sugar, Mike and anyone who does not go around making the game miserable for others is going to be defeated.Angry Onionshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02750018939886265706noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-83509747811540529622015-01-29T02:42:13.395-05:002015-01-29T02:42:13.395-05:00I wonder if it's more the public face of the c...I wonder if it's more the public face of the community that can be off-putting... When I was looking into Eve, google always popped up themittani.com and evenews24.com on the first result page. Themittani commenters as an example, can be thoughtful and intelligent, but when they do let rip, ne'er a bunch of less welcoming, more bigoted, vulgar, ultraviolent mouth-breathers can be found. Except in the Evenews24 comments... and the Eve forums... The real community cultures seem to be hidden inside the game, keeping low profiles to avoid being locked as primary targets by the loud tub-thumpers, only available *after* you've decided to give it a try. If it wasn't for E-Uni I may have passed over Eve. Thank God(Bob) for E-Uni. But I don't think I feel that way because I'm female so much as because I'm not a fan of Lord Of The Flies styled tribalism. I don't know the answer to increasing female participation. I do enjoy That Moment on coms when the sweet doofuses realise that I really, truly, am a girl, and I wasn't joking when I said "not all the girls in Eve are boys". Also: while I definitely see casual sexism everywhere in Eve ("if they try to learn pvp, sometimes they can get as good as us", oh ffs really?), in 4 months I've never been harassed or abused for being a woman. My male alt on the other hand has been told to shut up in chat for asking dumb questions, been hunted while I've been ignored...Ariyelhttp://www.eveonline.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-85723263215167657272015-01-29T02:16:41.753-05:002015-01-29T02:16:41.753-05:00+1. Sadly :(+1. Sadly :(Heretic Caldarihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03015635188565858672noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-38112593693219773602015-01-29T00:49:18.840-05:002015-01-29T00:49:18.840-05:00I've played other MMOs as well, and I have see...I've played other MMOs as well, and I have seen same sort of machismo and desire to hurt others in those as well. The amount of it does vary and by my experience correlates strongly with the proportion PvP takes in the game. Oh, and both men and women do partake in the machismo and tear harvesting - it is not just male thing.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-55548876967748620202015-01-28T23:28:52.053-05:002015-01-28T23:28:52.053-05:00I believe that Onions no longer plays.I believe that Onions no longer plays.Sugar Kylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15437978687639772023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-71311792358490238822015-01-28T23:25:42.113-05:002015-01-28T23:25:42.113-05:00I hope that it gets rid of you first Onions...I hope that it gets rid of you first Onions...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-19609310743030213032015-01-28T22:41:34.597-05:002015-01-28T22:41:34.597-05:00Given a satellite's orbit and coordinates of a...Given a satellite's orbit and coordinates of a ground terminal on earth I can manually calculate the azimuth and elevation of a sat terminal needed to make a connection..... and I'm a woman. In fact, I'm normally surrounded by men at work who are very obviously worse at their jobs than I am. :)rykkihttp://independantpraetorian.weebly.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-70259124945679898672015-01-28T22:22:00.014-05:002015-01-28T22:22:00.014-05:00Very interesting article, Sugar. A couple comment...Very interesting article, Sugar. A couple comments:<br /><br />The writer in question writes for Kotaku, a site that draws a very specific profile of reader in higher-than-average proportion. I enjoy the articles, but much like a reddit post's comments, you can kind of guess how the comments are going to go just by the site.<br /><br />As to the reason Eve, in particular, has a low female population, I think it's a combination of reasons. I can't claim to know all of them, but I would guess (and guess only) that the heavily mathematical "win at eve" approach is related. That's not to say that women can't or choose not to do math, but that the appeal of a mathematical problem appeals more to a "solver" than a "explorer/discussor" personality type. Men are the former in higher proportion.<br /><br />I mean, just look at orbital velocity calculations... only a sadist would choose a game that does that. Talvorian Dexhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01349917611382684205noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-238324579504790.post-9491912574365829152015-01-28T19:32:32.930-05:002015-01-28T19:32:32.930-05:00That was meant to be read sarcastically, as I thou...That was meant to be read sarcastically, as I thought my follow-on sentence implied.<br /><br />That said, that's been my experience also, in most of the corps I've been in. It was so bad that I muted people on a regular basis. And I'm a guy and served in the army for 12 years.Heretic Caldarihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03015635188565858672noreply@blogger.com